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YouTube · by **Cool Ivysaur** » 21 May 2010, 20:36

Spoiler: Show

Overview:Ok obviously,im a bit bored to go deeper into the analysis of this team.I just started building it, based on the idea of a team that has the "element of surprise" while being effective both in and outside of Trick Room.
Im open to suggestions too 8-)

by **Zeus198** » 22 May 2010, 11:02

WOW! It's like you were in my head. I really like this idea of the "slow-guys' rocking" :lol:

Anyway, about the team

Cool Ivysaur wrote:
Dusknoir @ Leftovers
Relaxed
EVs: 252 Hp /252 Def / 4 SpDef
- Trick Room
- Pain Split
- Will-o-wisp
- Thunderpunch

The most important member of this team by far.Sets up Trick Room and allows every member of this team to destroy the modern "fragile sweeping" metagame.
Will-o-wisp cripples common leads and physical sweepers,Pain Split provides instant healing and durability while Thunderpunch takes care of Gyarados which is troubling this team a bit, after a Dragon dance(without Trick room in effect).

Not much to say here. A logical choice for a team set like this one. A bulky lead to take out of order the enemy lead, and set up your strategy by taking as many hits needed.

Swampert @ Choice Band
Adamant
EVs: 52 Hp /252 Att / 194 Def /10 Spe
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Avalanche

Opponent:"Nah swampert,it will set up stealth rocks for sure,let's bring in Gyarados to set up DD,Zapdos to kill with HP Grass or Forretress to stall it"
CB Waterfall against 252hp/def relaxed Forretress ( without Torrent activated) = 46.0% - 54.5%
CB Stone edge against 252hp/def bold Zapdos (without a critical hit) = 66.7% - 78.6%
CB Stone edge against 6hp/0def offensive Zapdos (without a critical hit) = 113.7% - 134.2%
CB Stone edge against 6hp/0def offensive Gyarados (without Intimidate) = 116.9% - 138.0%

Said sth? No comments. We all know swampert is a handy tool in the OU, by any possible set he can handle

Tyranitar @ Babiri berry
Brave
EVs: 252 Att / 232 SpAtt / 24 Spe
- Stone Edge
- Fire Blast
- HP Grass 70
- Pursuit

Not much to say here.HP Grass for Swampert,Fire Blast and Babiri for the Steels and Pursuit to kill Gengar.

The brave tyranitar isn't really common, as the calm,jolly or adamant edition are more useful. But again a good choice, as it needs minimum speed to work on the team strategy.

Bronzong @ Macho Brace
Sassy
Levitate
EVs: 252 Hp / 86 Att / 80 Def /92 SpDef
- Trick Room
- Hypnosis/Explosion
- Gyro Ball
- Earthquake

The other poke that sets up Trick Room,and is pretty vital for the team.Macho Brace to power up Gyro Ball,Earthquake for Heatran.

As expected the other trick room seter of the team. This also bulky, but you may want to consider an a more aggressive set
Brave
Levitate
252HP/252ATK/4SP
The moves remain the same, and about your dilima, i would go for explosion. You need a big bang, in either set.

Metagross @ Life Orb
Brave
EVs: 132 Hp / 252 SpAtt / 124 SpAtt
- Meteor Mash/Bullet Punch
- Earthquake
- HP Fire 70
- Grass Knot

If Trick Room is in play,it's a gg.This thing kills "Everything" 1-on-1.

Nothing more here. A good choice and the priority your team needed

Tangrowth @ Occa berry
Impish
Leaf Guard
EVs: 252 Hp / 228 Def / 28 Spe
- Power Whip
- Knock Off
- Leech Seed
- Sleep Powder

The only suporter of this team.Provides anti-stalling support with Leach seed which is also a good recovery source for the pokes setting up Trick Room.Stops Gyarados even after a Dragon Dance and gets rid of items.

This leaf poke covers every weakeness your team might had on the common OU weapons(f.ex. gyarados,tyrranitar) that the reat of the team wouldn't handle so well.I might also suggest this as a thought. It may not be too slow, but think about it

Celebi
Leftovers
Relaxed
Natural cure
252HP/128DEF/128SDEF
-Leech Seed
-Thunder Wave/Charge Beam
-Grass Knot
-HP Fire/HP Ice
It's a decent choice for covering up any holes you might have. You could use leech seed to recover a bit along with leftovers and also help the rest of the team if killed. Grass knot is celebi's stab powerfull move used to take out tyranitar or gyarados. Also for the gyarados factor you can choose either charge beam to take it out or thunder wave to cripple it and then hit it hard. As for the HP options, Fire is to take out possible forretress, metagross or scizor and Ice is for salamence or gliscor. Anyway, it depends on what you can't kill with the rest.

Overview:Ok obviously,im a bit bored to go deeper into the analysis of this team.I just started building it, based on the idea of a team that has the "element of surprise" while being effective both in and outside of Trick Room.
Im open to suggestions too

I really enjoyed this team. It looks really cool, good work

by **Alexis** » 22 May 2010, 11:35

Honestly I didn't analyse so deep the team but I immediatly run to write this message when I saw that you don't have in your team this little beast called Snorlax which in a Trick room Team you "have to" insert.
Brave snorlax, of course max atk, max HP, with Life Orb gains an amazing fire Power which you can exploit with his special XD move Selfdestruct that for his special effect half the defense of the hit Pokémon. ( Not Bad )
With this type of snorlax (using crunch to scary the ghosts) you can defeat all the Pokémon you find including skarmory because it takes a lot of damages by Selfdestruct and so you can sweep it all thanks of Machamp, or Metagross, or Tytar.
Here is the list of the damage of Snorlax' Selfdestruct:

VS Skarmory (Impish) Max hp,Max Def: 82-96%
VS Metagross (Impish) Max hp, Max Def: 72-93%
VS Cresselia (Bold) Max hp, Max Def: 100%
VS Heatran (Scarf-set): 100%
VS Gliscor (Impish) Max hp, Max Def: 100%
VS Bronzong (Relaxed) Max hp, Max Def: 92-100%
VS Swampert (Relaxed) Max hp, Max Def: 100%
VS Registeel (Impish) Max hp, Max Def: 71-84%
VS Jirachi (Impish) Max hp, Max Def: 85-100%

Bye bye

YouTube · by **Cool Ivysaur** » 22 May 2010, 11:46

Alexis wrote:Honestly I didn't analyse so deep the team but I immediatly run to write this message when I saw that you don't have in your team this little beast called Snorlax which in a Trick room Team you "have to" insert.
Brave snorlax, of course max atk, max HP, with Life Orb gains an amazing fire Power which you can exploit with his special XD move Selfdestruct that for his special effect half the defense of the hit Pokémon. ( Not Bad )
With this type of snorlax (using crunch to scary the ghosts) you can defeat all the Pokémon you find including skarmory because it takes a lot of damages by Selfdestruct and so you can sweep it all thanks of Machamp, or Metagross, or Tytar.
Here is the list of the damage of Snorlax' Selfdestruct:

VS Skarmory (Impish) Max hp,Max Def: 82-96%
VS Metagross (Impish) Max hp, Max Def: 72-93%
VS Cresselia (Bold) Max hp, Max Def: 100%
VS Heatran (Scarf-set): 100%
VS Gliscor (Impish) Max hp, Max Def: 100%
VS Bronzong (Relaxed) Max hp, Max Def: 92-100%
VS Swampert (Relaxed) Max hp, Max Def: 100%
VS Registeel (Impish) Max hp, Max Def: 71-84%
VS Jirachi (Impish) Max hp, Max Def: 85-100%

Bye bye

yeah,the problem with snorlax is that it adds a Fighting weakness,that's why he isn't in this team.

by **Alexis** » 22 May 2010, 14:49

Well if the problem is his weakness (but I don't think so) lets change a pokemon or two to cover it, I think Its a thing you can do to gain this amazing physical power...

by **The Wroth** » 22 May 2010, 21:07

Fighting weakness isn't Snorlax's problem, as you have one immunity and a resist, with three fire weaknesses. Snorlax has Thick Fat which basically gives it a fire resist which you might need, so don't rule it out.

As for the team i think you're trying to get your sweepers to kill everything, which won't really work. Mixed Tyranitar is a nice suprise but Swampert isn't that much of a threat to your team, especially as you're using Tangrowth. I'd go with an all physical set, Stone Edge/Crunch/Fire Punch/Aqua Tail or perhaps Earthquake. Maybe even consider Payback, because if you don't have the Trick Room set up, you're likely to go last and therefore double Payback's power.

Also, why do Swampert and Tyranitar have speed EVs? You may as well put them in HP or their defenses.

Otherwise i can see Heatran and Infernape causing you some grief but Swampert should be able to deal with them.

YouTube · by **Cool Ivysaur** » 23 May 2010, 09:55

The Wroth wrote:Fighting weakness isn't Snorlax's problem, as you have one immunity and a resist, with three fire weaknesses. Snorlax has Thick Fat which basically gives it a fire resist which you might need, so don't rule it out.

It is actually,combined with the typing of the other team members.If i put snorlax there,infernape will kill my whole team without even getting scratched.

The Wroth wrote:As for the team i think you're trying to get your sweepers to kill everything, which won't really work. Mixed Tyranitar is a nice suprise but Swampert isn't that much of a threat to your team, especially as you're using Tangrowth. I'd go with an all physical set, Stone Edge/Crunch/Fire Punch/Aqua Tail or perhaps Earthquake. Maybe even consider Payback, because if you don't have the Trick Room set up, you're likely to go last and therefore double Payback's power.

The fundamental law of a Trick Room team is kill as fast as you can,before getting killed.

The Wroth wrote:Also, why do Swampert and Tyranitar have speed EVs? You may as well put them in HP or their defenses.

I need them to outspeed certain pokes outside of Trick Room.

by **Alexis** » 23 May 2010, 11:51

Cool Ivysaur wrote:It is actually,combined with the typing of the other team members.If i put snorlax there,infernape will kill my whole team without even getting scratched.

Without changing a single Pokè nape without trick room will kill your whole team without even getting scratched anyway, the only who resist its dusknoir which is lead and so probably he would be the first to die.
The problem of infenarpe persist, so or do you put a pokèmon which can trick (room) and resist to infernape, like cresselia, and so you can put snorlax which I can ensure will kill everyone on his path, and if there is a problem, its enough to push the red bottom to seldestruct and kill avery unlucky skarmory or bronzong or random-steel type.Defeat it you can esasily sweep with a Machamp wich personally I think Its much better than a Choice Band Swampert.
Try to avoid the skarfed pokemon on a trick room, because as you said the goal of a trick room is:

Cool Ivysaur wrote:The fundamental law of a Trick Room team is kill as fast as you can,before getting killed.

and if your enemy (its not difficult) undestand that you are skarfed is the end because he will switch a resistence you will switch the following turn once your enemy has already set up...

Cool Ivysaur wrote:I need them to outspeed certain pokes outside of Trick Room.

Infact I think you need or Cresselia as I wrote before, of a very fast tricker to put the trick room again for the final sweep, something expendable like gengar or kazam, just to put the trick.

by **Ombra** » 26 May 2010, 14:34

In a Trick Room team Ice Punch on Swampert, instead of Avalanche, isn't better?

YouTube · by **Cool Ivysaur** » 26 May 2010, 21:50

Ombra wrote:In a Trick Room team Ice Punch on Swampert, instead of Avalanche, isn't better?

I was thinking a lot about this,and chose Avalanche as it has enough power to kill what it needs to kill.Besides i wanted the team to work well outside of trick room too.
But,i guess Ice Punch is good choice too.It's more of personal preference.

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